help! where are all my docs, pics, music files....

To help you get better assistance, I'm converting this to a "question" instead of a bug.

Also, did you install Ubuntu as a dual boot with Windows or as a replacement to windows? During install did you choose to reformat or repartition your hard drive?

DId you tell ubuntu to use the whole disk when you installed? Ubuntu does warn that all data will be destroyed at multiple times during the install process.

Ubuntu does not install to NTFS but can read and write to it. Sounds like you have merrily clicked next like a good windows user and told Ubuntu to use the entire disk for the install.

I would recommend you restore your data from backup to your Ubuntu OS and you can use it there.

When you switch on the computer do you get a menu with a couple of different choices for Ubuntu a "memtest" and an option for booting into Windows?

Also try going up to the "Places" menu on the top taskbar - hopefully your Windows partition will be called something 'helpful' like "20Gb Media" If you can't find Windowsish looking folders in any of these thn you might need to use this guide
https://help.ubuntu.com/community/DataRecovery

Although it makes it sound a lot easier than it is. Usually the best bet is to find a local data-recovery service. Even if they advertise as being only able to deal with Windows problems they can usually deal with linux issue much more easily.

I hope something here helps!
Good luck and regards from
Tom

Dear Tom:

I do not get an option for booting into Windows when I turn the machine on.
I looked under "Places" and apparently I didn't create a Windows partition
either. I guess that means I removed Windows and all the data it
contained. I never dreamed changing my OS would remove all my data. Just
goes to show you how little I know about this stuff.

However, you have given me hope that all is not lost forever! Thank you so
much for your help!

Bonnie

On Tue, Jun 30, 2009 at 2:47 PM, Tom <email address hidden>wrote:

> Your question #75724 on Ubuntu changed:
> https://answers.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+question/75724
>
> Tom proposed the following answer:
> When you switch on the computer do you get a menu with a couple of
> different choices for Ubuntu a "memtest" and an option for booting into
> Windows?
>
> Also try going up to the "Places" menu on the top taskbar - hopefully your
> Windows partition will be called something 'helpful' like "20Gb Media" If
> you can't find Windowsish looking folders in any of these thn you might need
> to use this guide
> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/DataRecovery
>
> Although it makes it sound a lot easier than it is. Usually the best
> bet is to find a local data-recovery service. Even if they advertise as
> being only able to deal with Windows problems they can usually deal with
> linux issue much more easily.
>
> I hope something here helps!
> Good luck and regards from
> Tom
>
> --
> If this answers your question, please go to the following page to let us
> know that it is solved:
> https://answers.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+question/75724/+confirm?answer_id=3
>
> If you still need help, you can reply to this email or go to the
> following page to enter your feedback:
> https://answers.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+question/75724
>
> You received this question notification because you are a direct
> subscriber of the question.
>

Thank you, Vihar. I agree with you that a big, bright, scary-looking message stating possible loss of data during Ubuntu installation may have prevented me a lot of grief. Or perhaps Ubuntu installation should only be done by people who have a good understanding of computers and how they operate. Either way, I'm an incompetent computer user, and I have learned my lesson (for now anyway). I'm very sad having lost so many years photos, music, etc. But I guess it's time for a fresh start. Anyone with any sense at all would have had all their computer files backed up anyway (and I would have too if I knew how to back up my files onto disk). Acceptance is the last stage of grief, and I'm working on accepting that that's what I get for being only smart enough to be a danger to myself.

Bonnie, thanks for pointing this out.

This is currently a registered bug too (the warning should be more obvious). I'm going to try to register something in brainstorm as well.

https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubiquity/+bug/204053

Here's the brainstorm link:
http://brainstorm.ubuntu.com/idea/20480/

To all who helped with this: please add other solutions if you can think of more and vote if it gets accepted.

Losing data is gutting but has happened to most of us at some time or other :(

Data recovery becomes increasingly less likely if you keep using the machine. Ideally you get a different hard-drive from somewhere and plug that into your machine, taking your precious drive out (and wrap it in kitchen foil to protect it from static charges such as you have on your skin and clothing). Someone technically minded should be able to do that in less than 15minutes if they have good access to your machine.

Having a different drive in your machine will feel a little different at first but it should be fairly easy to install a linux as a dual-boot
https://help.ubuntu.com/community/WindowsDualBoot
Wolvix Hunter is good if you only have 2Gb free on the 'new' drive as it includes OpenOffice and full proper firefox.
http://distrowatch.com/table.php?distribution=wolvix
although, as you'll see from the homepage at DistroWatch there are plenty to choose from. Good to see Ubuntu is still easily number 1 in their popularity listing :))

Data-recovery experts do often charge quite a lot of money but it might well be worth it. If you want to try recovering the data at all then you really will have to stop using the hard-drive at all tho

Good luck and regards from
Tom :)

One problem with all these warning messages is that there are soo many of them, especially in Windows we just become blind to them and automatically click on Ok without bothering to read them. If we could get 'them' to cut error messages down to just ones that are really important then maybe we might take more notice. Linux already does this pretty well for the most part although firefox still has strange default settings for giving too many messages.

I think another idea is to force the default install into being a dual-boot but this needs to be in every distro and getting developers in different distros (or even in the same one often) to agree on something is like trying to herd cats.

Anyway, regards and all the best from
Tom

Ok, i've been to the bug report and clicked on "This bug doesn't affect me (change)" and also been to the brainstorming idea and added a comment and my alternative answer. The only thing i can't do is vote yet so i bookmarked it :)

Thanks Scott and maqifrnswa :)

Do you not have a backup? No backup = data is disposable.

My data is on a separate hard disk and the other (smaller) contains the OS-es only.
So when I installed for the first time Ubuntu (8.10, from the CD) I played with installing options to see what they do and how do they behave. I supposed there would be a warning (better in a single window without anything else) IMMEDIATELY before the formatting process starts to ensure the user is warned in the better way. No such a luck. Clicking on the button that says something like "Next" the formatting of the whole disk began.

So it is better to name the button of this action "Format" and better to have an option to confirm this action immediately before proceeding toward formatting.

So I formatted the XP partition by "mistake". This is not much a pain, just reinstalled it. Didn't wary much because the separated data disk gave me that freedom of playing.
But strange - the first (default) option of choice that the installation of 9.04 gave me was installing it on the whole DATA disk, not the system one (it is not so hard to detect automatically which disk is system, isn't it?). Now having in mind the not so user-friendly behaviour of 8.10 installation I simply opened the machine and unplugged the power of the data disk and restarted. It was because I was not sure at 100.00% what will do the installation with clicking "Next". And because the warning (too small in my taste) was one or two installation steps before the final formatting. I discussed this with my daughter and we joked between us - this underground way the ubuntuners want to force Windows-users to migrate fully to Linux ;-)

I started with computers with DOS in command-line regime. Than I found the old good Norton (Commander). It asked three times with large red messages before deleting some types of files.

Submit better messaging about drive data destruction as a future function. I suggest you also use the term "Big red messages" too. Sounds silly but highlights the point precisely. I have seen a few people in your predicament so you are not alone.

I suggest you try a program called foremost. It can scan a drive for files matching a certain criteria and spit them to another disk. If the bits that make up the data has been overwritten then they are lost but empty space is not empty but has the old bits that made up the old data, Only the FAT is emptied so data recovery can take place. You may be able to recover some of the data. Depends where it was on the platter as well as where the ubuntu install has written to. You never know, you may get lucky :D

No, I thing the FORMATTING which is done during installation changes all the addressing system (to compare: the streets in the town are totally new and with new names). And so even the File Allocation Table disappears.
Your case, actionparsnip, is valid to DELETING action only, I suppose. In this case only the first byte of the given file address is erased and marked in FAT as "empty".

The only way to truly delete data is to overwrite it, or use a disk scrubber which will write 0s to the entire drive, the data layer is still intact. The addressing system may have changed for the new data but the 1s and 0s are still there. foremost pays no attention to the current layount and only reads bits which can be any file system at all. If it finds something it recognises (and it does recognise ntfs based data) then it can recover some or all of a file and copy it as a complete file to another partition.

Exactly the same method is used If the disk has no partition table and therefore has no addressing system, the data is still possibly recoverable using foremost even if it was ntfs, fat32, ext3, watever. Its all the same to recovery tools.

The fat table is also quite likely still there but with it's first character changed, just like with files. A professional data recovery company could probably get most of your data back but the amount they can retrieve decreases dramatically with continued use of the drive
https://help.ubuntu.com/community/DataRecovery

Mostly tho i would consider this as 'lost data' and chalk it up to experience 'no pain, no gain'. Computer users seem to fall into 2 neat categories
1. People who seem almost excessive and paranoid in backing up everything
2. People that haven't had a catastrophic loss of data YET
There's even the famous theory that data doesn't really exist until there are 2 copies of it. I've only heard 1 person in the computer world be dismissive about data backups and that was Linus Torvalds! To be fair he said something like "Real men don't backup, they ftp it and millions of people download it" - ie, he gets other people to do his backing up for him ;)

To move forwards with this it would help if Bonnie, Vihar and others could visit the bug-report thread
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubiquity/+bug/204053
and at the top click on "This bug doesn't affect me (change)" and maybe add a comment too. Also visiting the brainstorming thread
http://brainstorm.ubuntu.com/idea/20480/
and adding a comment in there (or even vote if it lets you yet).

Thanks Scott and maqifrnswa for setting those two threads up :)
Good luck and regards from
Tom :)

I always backup as my data is important to me. Drives fail. My file server has a cron'd job every 6 12 hours to cp all my data to a 1Tb firewire drive (no slow USB fo me thank you very much). If my drive fails. I dont care, I can just cp the data back. I dont use fancy backup software or apps or differential backups, just cron and cp.

Simple.

Lol, yes people make backing up too complicated. Even the cron job method sounds quite advanced. I just drag and drop folders from one drive to my backup folder that's on a different physical drive.

Yes, I agree physically the bytes remain there on the disk. There must be a program achieving them. Peter Norton once have one in his NC. It allowed you even read or write physically bytes at given address.

It is a good Idea, Bonnie.
Let's try find such a program and see if it will be useful in your case. For that purpose it's better you don't work so much at your new Ubuntu.

foremost

Works great :)

GPart?

not GPartEd

does gparted recover data and files?

Well men, it is challenging question for me to help Bonnie to retrieve most of possible files from NTFS overridden by Unix File System Formatting. I'm stuck again with Peter Norton and am with him or his successors: that is

http://www.symantec.com/norton/save-restore

, see the line
"Recovers data even when you can’t restart operating system"

Could we help Bonnie recover all or some files she lost? I'm asking you, I've never tried this.

I think that if you're going to give this a serious go and spend money on it then pay a data recovery expert to do it. Buying odd tools here and there without really knowing how to use them is unlikely to achieve success in a short time. Doing a college course might get faster results! Also if you're looking around for software then why not look around at native linux tools that are likely to be free anyway.

@ ActionParsnip. No, when i said "Not gparted" i meant a different package that bears an annoyingly similar name - that's why i tried to make the distinction between gparted and gpart. Here's the synaptic entry

"
Gpart

Guess PC disk partition table, find lost partitions

Gpart is a tool which tries to guess the primary partition table of a PC-type
disk in case the primary partition table in sector 0 is damaged, incorrect or
deleted.

It is also good at finding and listing the types, locations, and sizes of
inadvertently-deleted partitions, both primary and logical. It gives you the
information you need to manually re-create them (using fdisk, cfdisk, sfdisk,
etc.).

The guessed table can also be written to a file or (if you firmly believe the
guessed table is entirely correct) directly to a disk device.

Currently supported (guessable) filesystem or partition types:

 * BeOS filesystem type.
 * FreeBSD/NetBSD/386BSD disklabel sub-partitioning scheme used on Intel
   platforms.
 * Linux second extended filesystem.
 * MS-DOS FAT12/16/32 "filesystems".
 * IBM OS/2 High Performance filesystem.
 * Linux LVM physical volumes (LVM by Heinz Mauelshagen).
 * Linux swap partitions (versions 0 and 1).
 * The Minix operating system filesystem type.
 * MS Windows NT/2000 filesystem.
 * QNX 4.x filesystem.
 * The Reiser filesystem (version 3.5.X, X > 11).
 * Sun Solaris on Intel platforms uses a sub-partitioning scheme on PC hard
   disks similar to the BSD disklabels.
 * Silicon Graphics' journalling filesystem for Linux.

Canonical does not provide updates for gpart. Some updates may be provided by the Ubuntu community.
"

"Buying odd tools here and there without really knowing how to use them is unlikely to achieve success in a short time."
Yes, Tom, you are right with this anyway.
Do you mind trying helping Bonnie in her own problem? I would try and the help of you or actionparsnip or someone like you would encourage solving this particular (or not) problem.

Well, it's interesting to me if this could be fixed.

I just wanted to give all of you, Tom, Scott, Actionparsnip, Scott, and
anyone I may have overlooked, a huge thank you for being so nice and trying
to help me rescue my data. I have called a local data recovery service and
they want $120-$180 to recover my data (I explained my situation and they
said it would be no problem to fix, just time consuming). I believe their
fee is likely pretty reasonable, and I probably would consider paying to
have this done if I were in a better financial situation, but for now I
think I'll just chalk this one up to experience. I do need a backup system
though, and I should probably invest in the Norton Save & Restore program.
It says it's for Windows XP/Vista. Do you guys know if it would this work
for Linux too?

On Wed, Jul 1, 2009 at 11:13 AM, Tom <email address hidden>wrote:

> Your question #75724 on Ubuntu changed:
> https://answers.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+question/75724
>
> Tom posted a new comment:
> I think that if you're going to give this a serious go and spend money
> on it then pay a data recovery expert to do it. Buying odd tools here
> and there without really knowing how to use them is unlikely to achieve
> success in a short time. Doing a college course might get faster
> results! Also if you're looking around for software then why not look
> around at native linux tools that are likely to be free anyway.
>
> @ ActionParsnip. No, when i said "Not gparted" i meant a different
> package that bears an annoyingly similar name - that's why i tried to
> make the distinction between gparted and gpart. Here's the synaptic
> entry
>
> "
> Gpart
>
> Guess PC disk partition table, find lost partitions
>
> Gpart is a tool which tries to guess the primary partition table of a
> PC-type
> disk in case the primary partition table in sector 0 is damaged, incorrect
> or
> deleted.
>
> It is also good at finding and listing the types, locations, and sizes of
> inadvertently-deleted partitions, both primary and logical. It gives you
> the
> information you need to manually re-create them (using fdisk, cfdisk,
> sfdisk,
> etc.).
>
> The guessed table can also be written to a file or (if you firmly believe
> the
> guessed table is entirely correct) directly to a disk device.
>
> Currently supported (guessable) filesystem or partition types:
>
> * BeOS filesystem type.
> * FreeBSD/NetBSD/386BSD disklabel sub-partitioning scheme used on Intel
> platforms.
> * Linux second extended filesystem.
> * MS-DOS FAT12/16/32 "filesystems".
> * IBM OS/2 High Performance filesystem.
> * Linux LVM physical volumes (LVM by Heinz Mauelshagen).
> * Linux swap partitions (versions 0 and 1).
> * The Minix operating system filesystem type.
> * MS Windows NT/2000 filesystem.
> * QNX 4.x filesystem.
> * The Reiser filesystem (version 3.5.X, X > 11).
> * Sun Solaris on Intel platforms uses a sub-partitioning scheme on PC hard
> disks similar to the BSD disklabels.
> * Silicon Graphics' journalling filesystem for Linux.
>
> Canonical does not provide updates for gpart. Some updates may be provided
> by the Ubuntu community.
> "
>
> --
> You received this question notification because you are a direct
> subscriber of the question.
>

The advice of mine is: well, they insure you they will recover. But until that you don't do anything with your new OS (Ubuntu) in order not to overwright physically your already existing files from previous file system.
Ask them before paying what do they can guarantee with your own case, please.

Bonnie. When i was in your position i just wrapped the drive in foil and went on a quick hunt around skips and friends houses - pretty soon found an ancient old hard-drive and plugged it in as a replacement. Then i struck gold and a local office block were just chucking their old machines out of their cupboards and let me take a fe home. I rescued drives, ram (mostly unusable), fans (one or two were ok) and an old power supply which i really should chuck away. Most offices have an ancient machine or 2 lurking in cupboards and just want an assurance you promise to properly delete all their data - which i have to say i'm quite good at :( Last week i finally saved up enough to get a decent drive and i'm going to practice my data-recovery skills any day now ;) If i can remember which sensible place i put the drive. $180 sounds vaguely right i guess.

As for backing stuff up in linux it's really very easy - you don't need to buy anything fancy. If you want to back up everything including settings and everything then just copy the entire "/home" folder onto a different drive, if you just want the data then simply drag the "/home/username/Documents", "/home/username/Vidoes", "/home/username/Pictures" etc folders onto dvd's or a drive - these are just the folders you find in the "Places" menu. There's a great tool for burning dvd's called "Brasero"

Applications - Sound&Video - Brasero

choose "Data disk" and then just drag and drop things into the empty white space there, when its full click "Burn".

To copy the entire "/home" is probably easier from the command-line

Applications - Accessories - Terminal

and into the terminal/command window/console try typing something like

cp /home /dev/sdb1/home

note there are 2 spaces in there. I'm sure actionparsnip can give you a better command to use although the "sdb1" bit depends on your hardware.

So to summarise i would suggest just unplugging the drive, wrap it in kitchen foil, put it back inside your case and get a 'new' hard-drive from somewhere to use until finances are better.

I hope this helps a little!
Good luck and regards from
Tom :)

That helps a LOT! Thank you!!! :)

On Wed, Jul 1, 2009 at 12:23 PM, Tom <email address hidden>wrote:

> Your question #75724 on Ubuntu changed:
> https://answers.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+question/75724
>
> Tom posted a new comment:
> Bonnie. When i was in your position i just wrapped the drive in foil
> and went on a quick hunt around skips and friends houses - pretty soon
> found an ancient old hard-drive and plugged it in as a replacement.
> Then i struck gold and a local office block were just chucking their old
> machines out of their cupboards and let me take a fe home. I rescued
> drives, ram (mostly unusable), fans (one or two were ok) and an old
> power supply which i really should chuck away. Most offices have an
> ancient machine or 2 lurking in cupboards and just want an assurance you
> promise to properly delete all their data - which i have to say i'm
> quite good at :( Last week i finally saved up enough to get a decent
> drive and i'm going to practice my data-recovery skills any day now ;)
> If i can remember which sensible place i put the drive. $180 sounds
> vaguely right i guess.
>
> As for backing stuff up in linux it's really very easy - you don't need
> to buy anything fancy. If you want to back up everything including
> settings and everything then just copy the entire "/home" folder onto a
> different drive, if you just want the data then simply drag the
> "/home/username/Documents", "/home/username/Vidoes",
> "/home/username/Pictures" etc folders onto dvd's or a drive - these are
> just the folders you find in the "Places" menu. There's a great tool
> for burning dvd's called "Brasero"
>
> Applications - Sound&Video - Brasero
>
> choose "Data disk" and then just drag and drop things into the empty
> white space there, when its full click "Burn".
>
> To copy the entire "/home" is probably easier from the command-line
>
> Applications - Accessories - Terminal
>
> and into the terminal/command window/console try typing something like
>
> cp /home /dev/sdb1/home
>
> note there are 2 spaces in there. I'm sure actionparsnip can give you a
> better command to use although the "sdb1" bit depends on your hardware.
>
> So to summarise i would suggest just unplugging the drive, wrap it in
> kitchen foil, put it back inside your case and get a 'new' hard-drive
> from somewhere to use until finances are better.
>
> I hope this helps a little!
> Good luck and regards from
> Tom :)
>
> --
> You received this question notification because you are a direct
> subscriber of the question.
>

Great advice~thank you very much!!!

On Wed, Jul 1, 2009 at 12:22 PM, Vihar
<email address hidden>wrote:

> Your question #75724 on Ubuntu changed:
> https://answers.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+question/75724
>
> Vihar posted a new comment:
> The advice of mine is: well, they insure you they will recover. But until
> that you don't do anything with your new OS (Ubuntu) in order not to
> overwright physically your already existing files from previous file system.
> Ask them before paying what do they can guarantee with your own case,
> please.
>
> --
> You received this question notification because you are a direct
> subscriber of the question.
>

And finally, Bonnie, it looks to me the answer of Tom containing the sentence

"A professional data recovery company could probably get most of your data back but the amount they can retrieve decreases dramatically with continued use of the drive"

solved your own problem.

I'll suggest you re-mark the mine (solving) answer to Tom's in order other people with similar question to find a solution of themselves here in Launchpad.

Good luck!

Err, i think everyone has contributed valuable things to this discussion. I have plenty of karma points and i think that original posting does have the essence of what people need to see unless they are prepared to put some time into solving a similar problem

Well, Tom, thank you!
But it's not a question of those "karma" things, isn't it? You, actionparsnip and me just tried to help Bonnie AND to solve a problem. Well, it looks like it is solved in your way. So let us be right in this particular problem, if you please.

I am very concerned Bonnie did you retrieve your data. Would you mind telling us you have/or not have success?

Thank you for asking; no.

On Thu, Jul 2, 2009 at 9:19 AM, Vihar
<email address hidden>wrote:

> Your question #75724 on Ubuntu changed:
> https://answers.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+question/75724
>
> Vihar posted a new comment:
> I am very concerned Bonnie did you retrieve your data. Would you mind
> telling us you have/or not have success?
>
> --
> You received this question notification because you are a direct
> subscriber of the question.
>

Bonnie, it should also be possible to buy a 'new' hard-drive. My vast brand new one cost £75 but that really does have far more space than you really need i suspect. I've heard of entire 2nd-hand machines being sold on ebay and place for as little as £5 although i think there must have been some luck involved there. 10 or 20Gb drives should be closer to a bit over £10 and even 10Gb is enough for Ubuntu, although i would aim to get a 20Gb one given a choice. We aren't really supposed to point to commercial sites but if you need help finding a half-decent drive then i'm sure people would help ;) Please let us know if this might help

Regards from
Tom

Hi Tom. My computer knowledge is very limited, as you can probably tell.
If I buy a new hard drive, will this enable me to recover my lost data off
of the old hard drive? In other words, I would buy and install a new hard
drive, take out the old one, take the old hard drive to a data recovery
service and hire them to retrieve my old data? I'm really in the dark
here. [?]
Bonnie

On Fri, Jul 3, 2009 at 7:08 AM, Tom <email address hidden>wrote:

> Your question #75724 on Ubuntu changed:
> https://answers.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+question/75724
>
> Tom posted a new comment:
> Bonnie, it should also be possible to buy a 'new' hard-drive. My vast
> brand new one cost £75 but that really does have far more space than you
> really need i suspect. I've heard of entire 2nd-hand machines being
> sold on ebay and place for as little as £5 although i think there must
> have been some luck involved there. 10 or 20Gb drives should be closer
> to a bit over £10 and even 10Gb is enough for Ubuntu, although i would
> aim to get a 20Gb one given a choice. We aren't really supposed to
> point to commercial sites but if you need help finding a half-decent
> drive then i'm sure people would help ;) Please let us know if this
> might help
>
> Regards from
> Tom
>
> --
> You received this question notification because you are a direct
> subscriber of the question.
>

Yes, that's exactly right.

However, you can wrap the old hard-drive in kitchen foil to try to protect it from static problems and just keep it, perhaps inside your case but not plugged in. You don't need to get the data back straight away, just keep the hard-drive protected until you are able to try getting the data back in maybe 6 months, maybe a year.

Great idea! Thank you!!!

On Fri, Jul 3, 2009 at 2:56 PM, Tom <email address hidden>wrote:

> Your question #75724 on Ubuntu changed:
> https://answers.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+question/75724
>
> Tom posted a new comment:
> Yes, that's exactly right.
>
> However, you can wrap the old hard-drive in kitchen foil to try to
> protect it from static problems and just keep it, perhaps inside your
> case but not plugged in. You don't need to get the data back straight
> away, just keep the hard-drive protected until you are able to try
> getting the data back in maybe 6 months, maybe a year.
>
> --
> You received this question notification because you are a direct
> subscriber of the question.
>

Hi :)

Have you been able to try the new Ubuntu 10.04 before it gets officially released?
http://www.ubuntulinux.org/testing/lucid/beta2
Trying it as a LiveCd or as an extra dual/multi-boot would be ideal. Developers and everyone are keen to try to iron out any problems before 10.04 gets officially released so you might find faster & more effective answers to your bug reports which would make 10.04 work better on your system for you

Thanks and regards from
Tom :)