saa716x

Asked by John May on 2018-11-06

I have been using a TBS 6928 on Ubuntu 14 16 and now onto 18.04. I can not get current drivers, open or closed ,to compile. It all appears to lack of module saa716x missing in the kernel.

Question information

Language:
English Edit question
Status:
Answered
For:
Ubuntu Edit question
Assignee:
No assignee Edit question
Last query:
2018-11-20
Last reply:
2018-11-20
Manfred Hampl (m-hampl) said : #1

Have you tried the instructions in https://www.linuxtv.org/wiki/index.php/TBS_driver_installation

What happens if you try compiling? Do you receive error messages?

John May (maihaus-bmts) said : #2

On 11/6/18 1:46 PM, Manfred Hampl wrote:
> Your question #675968 on Launchpad itself changed:
> https://answers.launchpad.net/launchpad/+question/675968
>
> Status: Open => Needs information
>
> Manfred Hampl requested more information:
> Have you tried the instructions in
> https://www.linuxtv.org/wiki/index.php/TBS_driver_installation
>
> What happens if you try compiling? Do you receive error messages?
>
Thank you for the speedy reply. May I say what a treat it is to see a
communication signed off with an actual name.

       I have been loading drivers for DVB cards from the time LinuxTV
only supported three cards, and haven't had any problems.

The TBS 6928 I used in Ubuntu 14 16 and now in 18.04. Trouble first
showed up when TBS upgraded their driver to 170330.

The TBS 6928 which calls for a saa7160 (rev3) module (driver) which used
to be in the kernel as saa716x.

       Anyway what I need is saa716x in the kernel along with the
drivers currently in there. I have located and downloaded

saa716x-master.zip. I read, as instructed, README.rst. for "Developers
and, supposedly, Users." I failed to find much at my user level.

I would like to work with this file and build it into a module I can
insert into the kernel.

  So please, a little help,  guidance, information, whatever, at User
level of course, to get saa716x into 4.15.0-38. Thank you.

Regards,

John May.

Manfred Hampl (m-hampl) said : #3

I cannot really help in detail, because I do not own any DVB card.

Where did you download this saa716x-master.zip package? Aren't there some instructions how to install the software?

Or - have you looked in the link that I gave?

John May (maihaus-bmts) said : #4

On 11/8/18 7:19 PM, Warner wrote:
>
>
> On 11/8/18 11:37 AM, Manfred Hampl wrote:
>> Your question #675968 on Ubuntu changed:
>> https://answers.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+question/675968
>>
>> Status: Open => Needs information
>>
>> Manfred Hampl requested more information:
>> I cannot really help in detail, because I do not own any DVB card.
>>
>> Where did you download this saa716x-master.zip package? Aren't there
>> some instructions how to install the software?
>>
>> Or - have you looked in the link that I gave?
>>
> Again a very speedy answer but far too speedy and as about useful as
> teats on a Bull. I  can only put it down to inexperience.
>
> Let me justify that. I spent 17 years as an International
> troubleshooter on the computerisation of the Newspaper Industry. I
>
> worked out of Boston MA. but was based in London Uk to eliminate 5
> hours time difference. There I sat behind a desk and fielded
>
> questions from service engineers in any Country in the EU Middle East
> or Africa. If I couldn't answer R and D was my only recourse.
>
>  So please don't take offence it takes many years to gain experience,
> especially at today's rate at which Technology moves
>
> You have a problem, that is  very common  these days, you do not read
> the question fully.
>
> You claim not to be able to help me in detail.  The fact is you can
> not help me at all Based on the fact you don't own a DVB card.
>
> What does a DVB card have to do with it, we are talking Drivers, could
> be a wireless card or any other.
>
> From where did I download the saa716x.master? What does it matter? I
> have it.
>
> Aren't there any instructions? As I said you don't read , I told you
> the Instructrions are in README.rst. and are instructions for a developer
>
> to build a new kernel. All I want, as a user, is to get a driver out.
>
> As regards the TBS link, you gave me,  I discarded that weeks ago they
> are open and closed drivers, one gives errors on make, the other does not
>
> build the modules because saa716x is not in the kernel. I sent a hard
> copy of the error to TBS support. They ignored it and told me to find
>
> some other driver.
>
>      As I said don't take offence, but learn. Do not answer questions
> you have not fully read and understand, take time to think through.
>
> Don't try to bluff you will end up digging yourself a hole.
>
> So what's the disposition of this question. Will you try to find the
> information I need or pass me on up the line to someone else who has
> the answers.
>
> Please let me know.
>

John May (maihaus-bmts) said : #5

-------- Forwarded Message --------
Subject: saa716x module.
Date: Sat, 10 Nov 2018 13:22:38 -0500
From: Warner <email address hidden>
To: Manfred Hampl <email address hidden>

   Say so

Hi Manfred,

      Thanks for the reply, as I said it helps to have a name to
communicate with. However it was not the reply I expected.

Having had many years experience fielding questions, on site, over the
phone and later by Email, so hope you will not take

offence over what I am about to say. Take it as a learnig.

       From your Email I conclude you are inexperienced, possibly young
and know little about the subject in question. There

is nothing shameful in that. Nobody can know everything. Experience and
knowledge will come. Your present need is the ability

to find out from whom what or where and pass on the information.

      Your first line, that you can't give details BECAUSE

Hi Manfred,

      Thanks for the reply, as I said it helps to have a name to
communicate with. However it was not the reply I expected.

Having had many years experience fielding questions, on site, over the
phone and later by Email, so hope you will not take

offence over what I am about to say. Take it as a learnig.

       From your Email I conclude you are inexperienced, possibly young
and know little about the subject in question. There

is nothing shameful in that. Nobody can know everything. Experience and
knowledge will come. Your present need is the ability

to find out from whom what or where and pass on the information.

      Your first line, that you can't give details BECAUSE! you don't
have a DVB card. Tells me two things, one you didn't read the

question properly.; A very common problem these days. You have only to
look on the net to see that. Also you didn't think before

you wrote it. What would you do if I said, "Never mind about details,
just give me the rough outline"? This is an example of digging

yourself into a pit.

Never answer a question with a question. Particularly something like
"did you read the instructions"? many people would would

find that offensive.

     When answering a question that you know nothing or little about
don't try to fudge it. Say so , tell them you will find the

information they and get back to them as soon as possible, and make sure
you do.

So all that being said, let's go back to square one.

I need the saa716x module

I have downloaded  saa716x.master.zip

I have un-zipped and attempted to compile it. Attached is a screen
print. Note line 4 it is trying tio make against 4.5.0  I have4.15.0

Obviiously configuration is needed. I have no experience in handling
master . PLEASE ADVISE.

Regards,

Warner.

Manfred Hampl (m-hampl) said : #6

1. English is not my mother tongue. It might be the case that I used (and use) expressions that are prone to misunderstanding. Please take this under account.
2. I do take your previous comment as offense.
I am not young and inexperienced. If you had done some research, you could have seen that I have a bit of a track record on Launchpad answers. There are more than 1,000 questions where the person asking has accepted my answer as "This solved my problem", see https://answers.launchpad.net/~m-hampl/+answeredquestions?field.status=SOLVED
3. Adding attachments to Launchpad questions does not work. You can only use plain text. Please check your question document on https://answers.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+question/675968

4. Back to your problem:
It seems that Ubuntu does not provide a kernel module saa716x.ko with its kernel packages (and has not provided one in the kernel packages for Ubuntu 14.04 and 16.04). There is a saa7164.ko module (but I do not know whether that is compatible to your TBS 6928 card, and I cannot test this myself, because I do not have such card).

My assumption is, that the kernel package needs to be self-compiled. A web search shows several different sources for this software, and you seem to have already downloaded a certain version, but failed with the compilation attempt. It is near to impossible to help, if you do not tell details about the software that you downloaded and tried to compile.

Additionally I would like to recommend collecting some diagnostic information.
What is the output of the commands

uname -a
lsb_release -crid
lspci
dmesg | egrep -i 'dvb|saa|firmw'

John May (maihaus-bmts) said : #7

   1 in 74

  Hi Manfre

      Since you took die Beleidigung I am surprised you are still
talking. As I had posed a question to Launchpad and it was answered I
naturally assumed it was answered by

Launchpad  Support. I see now I was wrong and it accounts for much

      Let me give you my Track Record. In the late sixties I became
involed in one of the biggest changes in the last hundred years. The
change printing from Hot Metal

to Cold Type. I was working, in Western Canada for a company that came
up with a computerised typesetter, operated by a skilled typist, that
could do the work of five men. These were to be installed in

newspapers. It was my job to install,  train operators maintenance
people, modify and repair. This I did for a number of years without
resort to the office in San Francisco.

      Given the proliferation  of the equipment world wide it was found
necessesary to set up a support  group for the EU and middle East. This
consisted of Sales Application Engineers INstructors and Technical Support.

I was offered a position in Technical Support. This I accepted. I was
moved  with my Family a nd household to London UK.

      For four years I fielded questions from  Europe The Middle and
Africa. I was away from my desk much of the time. Newspapers have one
thing in common  Deadlines, down time can not be tolerated. If anything
went down

and they couldn't fix it locally Tech Support was the last line of
defence  and one of us had to get on a plane and do it for them. Myself
I worked in every country in the EU except Portugal I was in Greece
Lebanon Iran

and West Africa. In Germany I got them going in Aachan Dusseldorf,
Frankfurt, Wiesbaden, Hannover, Munich, Wuppertal, Wien and Salzburg.

So perhaps you won,t feel too bad about having a little critique.

      There is nothing wrong with your English, it is grammatical
correct and well put, you express well. I have worked with many Germans
in the field  and found most of them had a good command of English  Far
more than

the English with German.

      I have answered questions for many years and have never heard of
anyone doing any research beforehand. In our operation they would never
know who would be answering their question. I did however follow on

your record. 1 in 74

      I did check on my question document. No relevance. No where have I
requested how to load drivers. I have asked how to configure the master
to build one. However FYI  after loading said driver.

   $modprobe FATALmodule saa716x not found in 4.15.0-38-generic. QED

Why are you harping on 14.04 and 16.04. I am 0n 18.04  However FYI. It
was possible to use the Linux driver from TBS web site by removing the
media folder from the kernel this was impossible towards the end of
16.04 when

TBS upgraded their driver to 117330.

      There is certainly  a saa7164 in the kernel. The TBS 6928 uses a
Philips chip requiring an saa7160

      I have not downloaded a kernel. I allow kernels to update as
Ubuntu sees fit

      I repeat I have saa716x.master.zip  I unpack it and tried to make
against 4.15.0-38  it tries to make to 4.5....common sense tells me one
of the many config. files need to be edited. Had you been able to see my
attachment

you would have  the error line. One of the most useful tools is a hard
copy indicating the error site.

      As regards to the recommendation they wouldn't be of the slightest
help to you in finding who can answer the Question " How do I build a
module from the Master.?"

"Had this come across my desk I would have answered it something like
this. "I am not familiar with the building of modules this would be in
the realm of the programmers. Unfortunately I am unable to open your
attachment.

However if you  send it to my personal adess I will get it  into the
programmers and get back to you as soon as possible with the disposition."

        There seems to be a lot of people messing around  with Launchpad
questions. Do any of you actually have anything to do with Launchpad if
they do why can't you contact them when you can't answer a question?

Why don't they back you up?

n 11/10/18 3:58 PM, Manfred Hampl wrote:
> Your question #675968 on Ubuntu changed:
> https://answers.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+question/675968
>
> Status: Open => Needs information
> Now
> Manfred Hampl requested more information:
> 1. English is not my mother tongue. It might be the case that I used (and use) expressions that are prone to misunderstanding. Please take this under account.
> 2. I do take your previous comment as offense.
> I am not young and inexperienced. If you had done some research, you could have seen that I have a bit of a track record on Launchpad answers. There are more than 1,000 questions where the person asking has accepted my answer as "This solved my problem", seehttps://answers.launchpad.net/~m-hampl/+answeredquestions?field.status=SOLVED
> 3. Adding attachments to Launchpad questions does not work. You can only use plain text. Please check your question document onhttps://answers.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+question/675968
>
> 4. Back to your problem:
> It seems that Ubuntu does not provide a kernel module saa716x.ko with its kernel packages (and has not provided one in the kernel packages for Ubuntu 14.04 and 16.04). There is a saa7164.ko module (but I do not know whether that is compatible to your TBS 6928 card, and I cannot test this myself, because I do not have such card).
>
> My assumption is, that the kernel package needs to be self-compiled. Awever FYI
> web search shows several different sources for this software, and you
> seem to have already downloaded a certain version, but failed with the
> compilation attempt. It is near to impossible to help, if you do not
> tell details about the software that you downloaded and tried to
> compile.
>
> Additionally I would like to recommend collecting some diagnostic information.
> What is the output of the commands
>
> uname -a
> lsb_release -crid
> lspci
> dmesg | egrep -i 'dvb|saa|firmw'
>

Manfred Hampl (m-hampl) said : #8

Some general remarks:

"Had you been able to see my attachment you would have [seen] the error line."
Launchpad answers does not accept attachments.
There are the following possibilities:
- instead of creating a screenshot image, copy/paste the information as plain text and put it into the message body
- if it is a big amount of text, upload it to a webhosting service (e.g. pastebin.org) and paste the link to the text into the message body
- upload the image to some image hosting service on the web and make it publicly accessible, paste the link to the image into the message body

Most people working on answers.launchpad.net (including myself) are volunteers who spend their free time trying to help other users. I am not a member of "Launchpad Support", and I do not have any direct link to programmers to whom I could forward your information.

$modprobe FATALmodule saa716x not found in 4.15.0-38-generic. QED
This is what I already wrote: There is no saa716x kernel module available in the Ubuntu-provided version of the kernel packages. So the command "modprobe saa716x" MUST fail as long as you have not successfully built this module yourself.

"I have not downloaded a kernel."
Which comment from my side did you interpret that you should download a different version of the kernel?

Do you expect further help, and if yes, what exactly do you need?

John May (maihaus-bmts) said : #9

Thank you Manfred. I can not get back to you as fast as I would like. I
am snowed in. Earlier and Heavier. I have to gas up my snowblower and
hope it starts, Clear down to the road, Come back load up my winter wheels.

Drive down to the road hoping the snow plough has been by and head down
town and get them installed.

I do not expect any further help since you like myself are unable to
getineeded information.   You know exactly what I need. I repeat. I need
an saa716x Driver.

On 11/15/18 3:37 AM, Manfred Hampl wrote:
> Your question #675968 on Ubuntu changed:
> https://answers.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+question/675968
>
> Status: Open => Needs information
>
> Manfred Hampl requested more information:
> Some general remarks:
>
> "Had you been able to see my attachment you would have [seen] the error line."
> Launchpad answers does not accept attachments.
> There are the following possibilities: I have to gas up my Snow
> - instead of creating a screenshot image, copy/paste the information as plain text and put it into the message body
> - if it is a big amount of text, upload it to a webhosting service (e.g. pastebin.org) and paste the link to the text into the message body
> - upload the image to some image hosting service on the web and make it publicly accessible, paste the link to the image into the message body
>
> Most people working on answers.launchpad.net (including myself) are
> volunteers who spend their free time trying to help other users. I am
> not a member of "Launchpad Support", and I do not have any direct link
> to programmers to whom I could forward your information.
>
> $modprobe FATALmodule saa716x not found in 4.15.0-38-generic. QED
> This is what I already wrote: There is no saa716x kernel module available in the Ubuntu-provided version of the kernel packages. So the command "modprobe saa716x" MUST fail as long as you have not successfully built this module yourself.
>
> "I have not downloaded a kernel."
> Which comment from my side did you interpret that you should download a different version of the kernel?
>
> Do you expect further help, and if yes, what exactly do you need?
>

Manfred Hampl (m-hampl) said : #10

Back to square one.
"I need an saa716x Driver."

I assume that you are not the only person with such need.
There are some web pages offering something, what they claim provides a saa716x driver (after compilation).
Even if I do not need such driver myself, I am prepared to help you in an attempt to build such driver.

There are several sources available, e.g. (based on a google search)
https://bitbucket.org/powARman/v4l-dvb-saa716x/overview
https://github.com/ljalves/linux_media/wiki/Installating
https://github.com/s-moch/linux-saa716x
http://powarman.dyndns.org/hgwebdir.cgi/v4l-dvb-saa716x
https://www.tbsdtv.com/download/index.html?path=13&id=68
and many, many more

Which source are you using?
What exactly happened when you tried compiling the driver?
You have to be aware that there are changes between the different versions of the kernel. It might be the case, that you have to apply patches, if you want to compile the driver for a different kernel version than the one for which the driver was designed.
I already spotted some patch sets for the different kernel versions (e.g. https://gitweb.gentoo.org/repo/gentoo.git/tree/media-tv/v4l-dvb-saa716x/files/ )

And for diagnostic purposes, what is the output of the commands

uname -a
lsb_release -crid
lspci
dmesg | egrep -i 'dvb|saa|firmw'

John May (maihaus-bmts) said : #11

Hi Manfred I'm back,

     I see you have answered out turn, pity you didn't wait. I had a
couple of comments. Fact is you will never been able to answer my
question, you don't even remember what it was. During our entire
discourse. you didn't

even mention it. I seem to remember saying something  about digging
yourself into a pit. This is exactly what what you have done. You have a
fault that is only too common these days. You don't completely read the
question and you get off on the wrong foot and stay there. Since I posed
a question to Launchpad and received an answer I assumed you to an
employee of Launchpad. You now reveal you are a Volunteer doing it of
your own back. That explains a lot. However I was not It was my job and
I was very good at it. In return for which I received an annual salary,
which in today's money would equal about euros 100500. I think I might
something to offer you.

I will answer this in two weeks time. I would like you to re-read my
original question. Read information I have given you and read it again
and apply it. See if there a any changes you would care to make in your
message.

Go to your browser enter ''Druck und Papier" I was obliged to go to all
the exhibitions along with my colleagues and a couple of Application
Specialists There we had to answer questions from all sides face to face.

First line November 1948 .I had just in Gutersloh. Iwas an 18 year old
Airman. Do your arithmetic you've got my age. Everyone's young to me.

If you feel satisfied with what you've written let me know by
means.Please take your.time I can't promise to get bak to your within
two weeks.

On 11/15/18 8:27 AM, Manfred Hampl wrote:
> Your question #675968 on Ubuntu changed:
> https://answers.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+question/675968
>
> Status: Open => Needs information
>
> Manfred Hampl requested more information:
> Back to square one.
> "I need an saa716x Driver."
>
> I assume that you are not the only person with such need.
> There are some web pages offering something, what they claim provides a saa716x driver (after compilation).
> Even if I do not need such driver myself, I am prepared to help you in an attempt to build such driver.
>
> There are several sources available, e.g. (based on a google search)
> https://bitbucket.org/powARman/v4l-dvb-saa716x/overview
> https://github.com/ljalves/linux_media/wiki/Installating
> https://github.com/s-moch/linux-saa716x
> http://powarman.dyndns.org/hgwebdir.cgi/v4l-dvb-saa716x
> https://www.tbsdtv.com/download/index.html?path=13&id=68
> and many, many more
>
> Which source are you using?
> What exactly happened when you tried compiling the driver?
> You have to be aware that there are changes between the different versions of the kernel. It might be the case, that you have to apply patches, if you want to compile the driver for a different kernel version than the one for which the driver was designed.
> I already spotted some patch sets for the different kernel versions (e.g.https://gitweb.gentoo.org/repo/gentoo.git/tree/media-tv/v4l-dvb-saa716x/files/ )
>
> And for diagnostic purposes, what is the output of the commands
>
> uname -a
> lsb_release -crid
> lspci
> dmesg | egrep -i 'dvb|saa|firm

Manfred Hampl (m-hampl) said : #12

I am sorry, but I am lost.

"You don't completely read the question"
There is no question in your Launchpad question document's title and description, but a statement:
"saa716x
Asked by John May on 2018-11-06
I have been using a TBS 6928 on Ubuntu 14 16 and now onto 18.04. I can not get current drivers, open or closed ,to compile. It all appears to lack of module saa716x missing in the kernel."
Please re-formulate the question.

Fact is:
There is no trace of a saa716x kernel module in any of the Ubuntu-provided kernel packages for Ubuntu 14.04, 16.04 and 18.04.
My conclusion:
If you were able to use your device TBS 6928 on Ubuntu 14.04 and/or 16.04, then this device must have been using a driver named differently, or you must have compiled a driver yourself, based on non-Ubuntu source.

If you want further help from me, please provide the information that I asked for in my second comment on 2018-11-15.

John May (maihaus-bmts) said : #13

Hi Manfred. I am terminating this. You have got the bit in your teeth
and rushed in your own direction.

I do not need any help in building and loading drivers. I told you I had
been loading DVB drivers since the third card that LinuxTV supported.

I know saa716x was not in Ubuntu 14 & 16.. I told this was got around by
removing the media folder from the Kernel. I f you had even  opened

   one of the sources you you could have read this for yoursel

.Another of your sources concerning v4l and a TBS driver. There was in
fact an error in the v4l. I sent TBS support a hard copy indicating
folder and lines.

    this was ignored and I was advised to try an other driver. They gave
me a source, which was the same as you came with, I have no idea why, as
the  answer to my question.

   I told you the result of this. I also gave you terminal ouptut on
modprobe.You claim to have told me this.

I also told you the TBS driver was upgraded to 117330 this did not work
and you could mot get around by the usual RM ing the media folder.

I do not need to be told saa716x is not in the kernel . I know. That is
why I located and downloaded  the LINUX-SAA716x-MASTER.ZIP. to build
the module and insert it.

I tried to MAKE It tries to make against the wrong kernel. Therefore my
common sense tells me that on of the numerous configuration files needs
to be edited with my uname -R

QUESTION. Which?

Finally if you had read any of your own sources you would have found,
one of them is in fact the saa716x master. You are about where I was a
year ago.

Having had a few years of experience, the best  advice I can give to
you, is read the question, if you don't understand the question, say so,
don't try and fool people, you'll dig yourself into a hole.

Never answer a question with a question.

Regards,

John May.

On 11/15/18 8:27 AM, Manfred Hampl wrote:
> Your question #675968 on Ubuntu changed:
> https://answers.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+question/675968
>
> Status: Open => Needs information
>
> Manfred Hampl requested more information:
> Back to square one.
> "I need an saa716x Driver."
>
> I assume that you are not the only person with such need.
> There are some web pages offering something, what they claim provides a saa716x driver (after compilation).
> Even if I do not need such driver myself, I am prepared to help you in an attempt to build such driver.
>
> There are several sources available, e.g. (based on a google search)
> https://bitbucket.org/powARman/v4l-dvb-saa716x/overview
> https://github.com/ljalves/linux_media/wiki/Installating
> https://github.com/s-moch/linux-saa716x
> http://powarman.dyndns.org/hgwebdir.cgi/v4l-dvb-saa716x
> https://www.tbsdtv.com/download/index.html?path=13&id=68
> and many, many more
>
> Which source are you using?
> What exactly happened when you tried compiling the driver?
> You have to be aware that there are changes between the different versions of the kernel. It might be the case, that you have to apply patches, if you want to compile the driver for a different kernel version than the one for which the driver was designed.
> I already spotted some patch sets for the different kernel versions (e.g. https://gitweb.gentoo.org/repo/gentoo.git/tree/media-tv/v4l-dvb-saa716x/files/ )
>
> And for diagnostic purposes, what is the output of the commands
>
> uname -a
> lsb_release -crid
> lspci
> dmesg | egrep -i 'dvb|saa|firmw'
>

Manfred Hampl (m-hampl) said : #14

"Never answer a question with a question."

You did not ask questions, but made statements. I do not see any question mark in your text except in "QUESTION. Which?"

Can you help with this problem?

Provide an answer of your own, or ask John May for more information if necessary.

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