Difference between /z, $z and $$z in generator level

Asked by Sagar Modak

I am not able to understand the physics behind the following three commandsin MadGraph:

generate e+ e- > e+ e- h /z
generate e+ e- > e+ e- h $z
generate e+ e- > e+ e- h $$z

I have gone through this tutorial:
http://cp3.irmp.ucl.ac.be/~omatt/MG5_TUTO.pdf

In this tutorial, it is stated that /z forbids the z particle completely. What I understand from the statement is that this commands does not generate any process even at loop levels i.e., it completely ignores z. Now for $z, it says that it forbids the s-channel only. So we might be able to get diagrams for other channels and also for loop levels. But $$z is not there.

My query is, when I generate these 3 processes and plot their cross-section for different centre-of-mass energies, they give different variations of the cross-section, why is that?

Any help in this regard, is highly appreciated.

Question information

Language:
English Edit question
Status:
Answered
For:
MadGraph5_aMC@NLO Edit question
Assignee:
No assignee Edit question
Last query:
Last reply:
Revision history for this message
Olivier Mattelaer (olivier-mattelaer) said :
#1

That tutorial was for version 1.1.0.

So clearly this is outdated and that version was not able to compute loop, so do not infer any conclusion about loop from that tutorial.
Actually the meaning of the syntax change since that version/tutorial (as written in the update Notes)

The meaning of the syntax "$" was changed in 1.3.18 (04/10/11)
and the new syntax "$$" (taking back the meaning of the previous $ syntax) has been added in 1.4.3 (08/03/12)

So make sense that those explanation are wrong in such tutorial.

So the meaning of the "$$" is actually forbids the s-channel.
The meaning of the "$" denoted the exclusion of ONSHELL s-channels while
                      keeping all diagrams (i.e., complemetary to the decay
                      chain formalism). This reduces the problems with
                      gauge invariance compared to previously.
                      "Onshell" is as usual defined by the "bwcutoff" flag
                      in the run_card.dat.

So this is implemented as a phase-space cut and not as a diagram removal method.

Cheers,

Olivier

PS: Here is a list of lecture/tutorial which are much more up-to-date

Revision history for this message
Sagar Modak (sagarmodakiisc) said (last edit ):
#2

Okay I understand. But please tell me one thing:
generate mu+ mu- > mu+ mu- h

This command generates two diagrams.

generate mu+ mu- > mu+ mu- h $$z

removes the "diagram 1" and only generates "diagram 2".

How can I get only the "diagram 1"?

I mean how can I only get the "s-channel" diagram?

Also, I am not able to see the list of the lectures/tutorials that you mentioned.

Revision history for this message
Olivier Mattelaer (olivier-mattelaer) said :
#3

Hi,

Like $$ is a bad syntax since it is common that such syntax breaks gauge invariance.
But yes we have a similar opposite syntax which is
generate mu+ mu- > z > mu+ mu- h

While the opposite of the "$" syntax is the decay chain syntax so the opposite of
generate p p > w+ b j $t
is
generate p p > t j, t > w+ b

(which are safer for gauge invariance)

Cheers,

Olivier

Revision history for this message
Sagar Modak (sagarmodakiisc) said :
#4

Yes. I just found out that the command
generate mu+ mu- > z > mu+ mu- h

produces only the s-channel diagrams. But generate mu+ mu- > mu+ mu- h $$z generates only the t-channel diagrams. Is there any other way to generate only the t-channel diagrams other than this?

Also how breaking the gauge-invariance will affect the cross-section?

I couldn't find the resources that you mentioned there.

Revision history for this message
Olivier Mattelaer (olivier-mattelaer) said :
#5

Here is the most complete answer on how to do diagram filtering.

For the gauge invariance, it means that the reported cross-section depends on arbitrary parameter.
In EW process, the gauge invariance is canceling the energy growing of the amplitude (such that the process is unitary)
So if you break such gauge invariance, what you obserce is that cross-section is typically enhanced at high energy (and can break unitary bound). On the other hand, the gauge fixing term are sometimes also used to cancel some specific contribution, so if you keep only that contribution, then the result can be zero.

So in summary, the result of a computation without gauge invariance can vary from zero to infinity. And the result makes sense only if you sum up all the configuration to form a gauge invariant subset.

Cheers,

Olivier
FAQ #3322: “How to select of subset of diagram for LO computation?”.

Can you help with this problem?

Provide an answer of your own, or ask Sagar Modak for more information if necessary.

To post a message you must log in.